Horror Movie Podcast Ep. 109: Split (2017) and The Bye Bye Man (2017) and The Best Damn 2017 Horror Preview on the Internet


Happy 2017! We usually at least feign humility on HORROR MOVIE PODCAST, but this four-hour and thirty minute episode has to be The Best Damn 2017 Horror Preview on the Internet. Or at least the most thorough. Damn right!

New listeners may find this particular episode to be quite unusual because we spend much of the time simply talking about release titles and dates, rather than reviewing movies, but there is also plenty of discussion about our most anticipated upcoming films when Jay of the Dead, Dr. Shock, and Wolfman Josh begin with the first Friday in January and discuss just about every known horror release, week by week, for 2017.

Afterward, Jay and Wolfman bring you one of their famous two-handers with a review of M. Night Shyamalan’s Split (2017), including a separate spoiler-section. Wolfman Josh also brings you a feature review of Stacy Title’s The Bye Bye Man (2017) and reports on whether Ti West’s In the Valley of Violence (2016) is a horror movie. And it wouldn’t be HMP if Jay of the Dead didn’t do a little rabble-rousing… Prepare to be up in arms!

Horror Movie Podcast is a bi-weekly show that’s released every other Friday. If you’d like to support our show, please subscribe to our podcast free in iTunes, and leave us a review! And remember, we love getting your voicemails, so call in with more recommendations and comments at this number: (801) 382-8789 Thanks for listening to Horror Movie Podcast, where we’re DEAD SERIOUS ABOUT HORROR MOVIES, damn it!


I. Introduction
— Dr. Shock’s DVD Infatuation update
— HMP Ep. 108 comments
— 2016 topics that we forgot to discuss
— 74th Golden Globes and Horror
— Movie Podcast Network teaser: March 1
— Jay of the Dead calls out some of the HMP community for hypocrisy!

[ 00:24:23 ] II. Feature Review: THE BYE BYE MAN (2017)
Wolfman Josh = 7.5 ( Theater / Rental )

[ 0:54:07 ] III. HMP’s 2017 HORROR PREVIEW

January 6, 2017
Underworld: Blood Wars
The Snare

January 13, 2017
The Bye Bye Man

January 20, 2017

January 27, 2017
Resident Evil: The Final Chapter

February 3, 2017

February 17, 2017
A Cure for Wellness
Patient Zero

February 24, 2017
Get Out

March 10, 2017
Personal Shopper
Kong: Skull Island

March 17, 2017
The Belko Experiment

March 24, 2017
Keep Watching
The Dark Tapes

April 7, 2017

May 19, 2017
Alien: Covenant

May 31, 2017

June 9, 2017
The Mummy
World War Z 2

June 30, 2017
Amityville: The Awakening

August 11, 2017
Annabelle 2

August 25, 2017

September 1, 2017
Sky Sharks

September 8, 2017

September 29, 2017

October 3, 2017
Intrusion: Disconnected
Maniac Cop (2017) – with Nicolas Winding Refn???

October 13, 2017
Friday the 13th

October 20, 2017
Insidious: Chapter 4

October 27, 2017
Cloverfield 2017 / The God Particle
Saw: Legacy

October 31, 2017
Dead Rising

December 1, 2017
He’s Out There

To Be Announced and “Wishful Thinkers”:

Jeepers Creepers 3: Cathedral
Wrong Turn 7: At the End of the Road
Bride of Frankenstein (2017)
Day of the Dead (2017)
Halloween (2017)
Cult of Chucky (An All-New Movie!)
Children of the Corn: Runaway
Island of the Dolls
Hellraiser: Judgment
Godzilla (2017) – Animated
Deathgasm Part 2: Goremegeddon
Resident Evil: Vendetta

Bloodsucka Jones vs. The Creeping Death
Demon House
Mom and Dad
Corbin Nash
47 Meters Down (aka In the Deep)
Cage Dive
Red Eye (2017)
Tokyo Ghoul
The Third Wave
Death House
Five Nights at Freddy’s
Cute Little Buggers
Giantess Attack
Killer Piñata
Dead Trigger

Monster Squad 2
The Night Watchmen

The Transfiguration
The Void
Another Evil
The Devil’s Candy
I Am a Hero
Bed of the Dead
Seoul Station
The Blackcoat’s Daughter
The Girl With All the Gifts
Let Her Out
Safe Neighborhood
Party Night

THRILLERS (but probably not Horror):

Before I Fall
All I See Is You
The Coldest City

Miscellaneous Commentary (Not Horror):

Ghost in the Shell
The Dark Tower
The Circle
The Lost City of Z
The Snowman
Murder on the Orient Express
Ghostbusters (2017) – ?

[ 03:18:41 ] IV. Horror Report: IN THE VALLEY OF VIOLENCE (2016)
Wolfman mini-reviews In the Valley of Violence and lets us know whether it’s a horror film.

[ 3:22:32 ] V. Feature Review: SPLIT (2017)
Wolfman Josh = 10 ( Theater / Buy it! )
Jay of the Dead = 7.5 ( Theater / Rental )

[ 04:08:04 ] VI. SPLIT SPOILERS

VII. Wrap-Up / Plugs / Ending

—James’ mystery movie is … Dreamscape (1984), according to the HMP community.
—Help Paul, from Schlock Horror, identify his mystery movie!
—Josh and Dave’s new podcast, Universal Monsters Cast, has launched.



—Check out our Top 10 Horror Movies of 2016 show!

—Check out Josh and Dave’s new Universal Monsters Cast with Joel Robertson of Retro Movie Geek!

Jay says to check out the LORE Podcast, Ep. 15: Unboxed

Jay of the Dead’s links:
Follow Jay of the Dead and Horror Movie Podcast Official Twitter
Horror Movie Podcast Official Facebook
Jay of the Dead covers new releases in theaters on Movie Podcast Weekly
And if you’d like to e-mail Jay of the Dead with a good Beastly Freaks recommendation: BeastlyFreaks@gmail.com

Wolfman Josh’s links:
Follow Josh on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook @IcarusArts
Horror Movie Podcast Official Instagram @HorrorMovieCast
Josh covers the Monsters Universe, new and classic, on Universal MonstersCast.com
Follow UMC on Twitter @MonstersCast
Josh covers streaming online movies on MovieStreamCast.com
Follow MSC on Twitter @MovieStreamCast
Like MSC on Facebook

Dr. Shock’s links:
Dave writes daily movie review on DVDinfatuation.com
Follow Dave on Twitter @DVDinfatuation
Like Dave’s DVD Infatuation, now on Facebook
Dave covers the Monsters Universe, new and classic, on Universal MonstersCast.com
Dr. Shock also appears on another horror podcast: Land of the Creeps

Dr. Walking Dead’s links:
Order Kyle’s new book! How Zombies Conquered Popular Culture: The Multifarious Walking Dead in the 21st Century
Order Kyle’s previous books American Zombie Gothic and Triumph of The Walking Dead
Follow Kyle on Twitter @DrWalkingDead

You can always contact us by e-mailing HorrorMoviePodcast@gmail.com. Or you can call and leave us a voice mail at: (801) 382-8789. And you can leave us a comment below the show notes for this episode.

NOTE FOR NEWCOMERS: If you love this podcast, there are 36 episodes of two other great podcasts that precede this one. Just scroll back through our archives, or use the links in the sidebar on the right.

Special thanks goes out to singer-songwriter Frederick Ingram for the use of his music for the original Horror Movie Podcast theme and composer Kagan Breitenbach for the use of his arrangement of Fred’s song for our updated theme.

If you like Horror Movie Podcast, please subscribe and leave us a review in iTunes. It really helps our visibility. You can also subscribe on GooglePlay or Stitcher. If you want to support the show even more, you can do so by becoming a patron of Movie Podcast Network and subscribing to our “Special Features” episodes by paying a small fee to get at least one bonus release each month through our official Movie Podcast Network Patreon page!

Thanks for listening, and join us again Friday after next for HORROR MOVIE PODCAST!





230 thoughts on “Horror Movie Podcast Ep. 109: Split (2017) and The Bye Bye Man (2017) and The Best Damn 2017 Horror Preview on the Internet

  1. Haven’t listened yet but want to say bye bye , bye bye man , very disappointing, could of been so much better , it’s a 4.5/10 from me?

    • I can appreciate Josh’s positive review, and I think the horror community should support this film…. but at the same time I have a bundle of criticism for it.

      In my heart it’s a 3/10, it’s a strong avoid, but I also say that if you want to see a fun popcorn horror flick with friends this will fix you up. I want to see more from these filmmakers because I think there is potential especially in developing the Bye Bye Man concept, but this film was a disappointment for me.

      • So what I said is, I realize, a bit contradictory.

        When I say we should “support this film”, what I mean is that I think it’s counterproductive to crap all over it like a lot of people on the internet are doing. I think if you were already interested in seeing “The Bye Bye Man”, you still should so you can form your own opinion and more importantly to support new concepts in mainstream horror cinema releases. What I like about this film is that it’s a fresh ideas, and has a really strong concept. I first heard the short story the film is based on one night in bed when I heard the author Robert Damon Schneck discussing it on a podcast. I thought it was a brilliant idea, genuinely creepy, and thought it had the potential to become its own franchise.

        When I rate it a 3/10 and call it an “avoid” by HMP rating standards, it’s because there were just too many aspects of the film that fell flat. The resounding thing here for me is “potential”. This story has potential! Stacy Title as a director has great potential. I think she has an interesting voice and different voice than I’ve seen in horror cinema, and I would personally love it if the studios give her the reins to another feature horror director project. She really crafts some effective scary sequences. I think Douglas Smith was really excellent in this film, and I think Carrie-Anne Moss was also really great. But some of the other actors in here are honestly some of the worst performances I’ve ever seen in a wide release film in a long time. That isn’t hyperbole either. Cressida Bonds who plays the girlfriend Sasha might have potential, but she really struck out big time for me. Faye Dynaway, who I also love in her classic films like Network, is just not great here. A few the very small three or four line very small part characters are worse than some of the non-professional actors in no budget local films I’ve seen. Again, I don’t want to trash this film. My other issues with the film were already voiced in this episode.

        Basically my take away is… show me more. I want to see more of this idea, and I want to see more of Stacy Title. I’m hopeful that the high box office this film got will give her the opportunity of doing more.

        • I think that’s true for any movie, Kagan. Regardless of my or anyone’s opinion, if you are really interested in seeing a movie go see it. But I get what you are saying 100% and I do not believe you are being contradictory.

          For me, I just thought ‘The Bye Bye Man’ was horrendous. I didn’t think really anything worked. The concept was somewhat interesting but the execution was so off. And no performance worked for me; granted, I think it had more to do with the writing than anything else.

          I am a fan of ‘The Last Supper’ and wish I could have better things to say because clearly this director can make a good movie but for me this is a 1.5 and I feel like I’m being generous. The best thing I can say is that if is this is the worst movie (horror or otherwise) I see this year then that’s not too bad.

          • WTF? I don’t get a 1.5 – have you seen Jan-Gel? More than 75% of the slashers we watched in October were worse than The Bye Bye Man. I think there is something with horror films that is the opposite of recency bias. People are much harder on new films than they are on older films. I can see all of the criticisms that people are lobbing at this, but it is still not that bad. Any rating under a 5 and I seriously question what movie people were watching.

            • Most of those slashers would probably be a 1/2 or 1 then. Not sure which ones you are referring to.

              The 1.5 is simply because I thought the concept was interesting and the production value was solid, but the execution was horrible. I can’t think of a single scene that worked for me. The 10 point scale has always been difficult for me. I’m old school with the 4 star rating so it would be a 1 or 1.5 star rating for me; whatever that equates to. Definitely not a 5 because I thought the movie was well below mediocre.

              But you like what you like; nothing personal.

          • Nothing personal, of course, and not even talking about liking what you like. I’m talking about on the scale of cinema, with all movies ever made on a 10 or 5 point scale, this is just not in the bottom 10%. Objectively. Maybe I’m wrong, but this feels like piling-on to me.

          • Fair point. It’s always tough to compare a movie you’ve seen once and recently to all the cinema you have seen in the past whether you love or hate it I guess. I’m 41 and I’ve seen a lot of movies, and to be fair, I’m 41 and this movie was not made for anyone near my age so I try to look at it from that perspective as well.

            However, as I’ve said, there was simply nothing in this film that worked on any level imo. It was a well crafted film on a technical level but on a storytelling level it fails 100% so I have a hard time giving this anything higher than i did. So for me, this would probably fall in the bottom 10% currently; that could of course change if I choose to watch it again at some point. I will say it’s not the worst horror movie I’ve seen so far this year; that would easily be ‘The Snare’ which I’m having a hard time even giving a 1/2 point to – it is the definition of dreadful. But I could definitley not go higher than a 3 for ‘Bye Bye Man.’

            And I didn’t think you were taking anything personal; not sure why I chose that word.

            And I have not seen Jan-Gel, Manos, Birdemic, etc. I’ve never been a huge fan of so bad it’s good so I tend to avoid films when I hear that unless there is actually something about the film that interests me. So you’re ‘Sleepaway Camp’ or ‘Urban Legend’ comparison is probably more apt or something more similar to this film that popped up in my head would be ‘Darkness Falls’ from 2003; very similar in tone and execution and neither work imo.

        • Come on. Everyone in this movie is better than everyone in Sleepaway Camp and that’s a classic. Everyone in Urban Legend and people go to bat for that film.

          People are being so unduly hard on this film. Strong avoid? Thankskilling is a strong avoid and some people still love THAT movie.

          The hate being piled-on this movie is so over the top. It’s blowing my mind.

          • I personally don’t like Sleepaway Camp so I guess I’m with you there. I think Urban Legend is way more fun than Bye Bye but that’s just me. I didn’t realize a lot of people enjoyed Urban Legend honestly.

            Fine, you’ve convinced me I was being too harsh. I’ll bump my rating up to a 2.

          • I absolutely love Bye Bye Man. I’ve already seen it twice and can easily say that I’ll put it on my short list rotation for awhile. The movie makes me feel good, it’s simple cheesy fun and does have some legit moments of scare.

            As a matter of fact, over the past few nights since last seeing the film, I find elements of it piercing my dreams.

            In my dreams I’m wandering through a town or a hospital or a familiar place in my childhood during the night. There’s mutilated bodies everywhere and everything is silent. In the dream I don’t want to know how this happened and I’m trying not to think about what I’m seeing as I try to casually walk away from it all. But as I can feel my fear growing, I can feel him getting closer. I’ll usually wake up as I see a black shadowy robbed figure approaching. Each time I have these dreams, he keeps getting closer…

            There’s something about the unknown of our monster that’s effective to my subconscious, and that wouldn’t normally be effective unless there was some legitimate horror in this film’s execution.

            It might not hold the spot, but right now it’s my top film of 2017, knocking Split and Pitchfork from the arena.


          • Come on Josh! Don’t bring Sleepaway Camp into this. Now I have to watch Bye Bye Man and compare to protect my nostalgia.

    • Here’s my review…

      THE BYE BYE MAN is a new and unique horror icon with a mythology that slowly unfolds throughout the film. Unfortunately, the mystery isn’t very focused or intriguing and the threat from the Bye Bye Man himself is weak. The opening scene was intense. The beginning of the film has some good character building except for the librarian who comes out of nowhere and squeezes into the plot. Maybe there were cuts? Also, the Bye Bye Man inexplicably has an animated dog buddy like Scooby-Doo. I liked it and give it a 6.5/10.

  2. Thanks for all the hard work you guys do to entertain us :)

    I believe what you do is very important to the horror community. Know that you are very appreciated.

    That said, I can’t F$&@ing wait to listen to this!

  3. It turns out that the animated Seoul Station takes place in the same universe as Train to Busan. Although it is technically a prequel, they are saying, there are supposedly no stories or characters that crossover.

  4. Listening to the episode now. On speaking about the size of Kong, I have heard rumors Legendary is going to do a Godzilla / Kong movie. If this is true it would make sense that Kong is a billion feet tall.

    • Good point. The original rumors were that Guillermo Del Toro was directing Skull island and that it was going to be Kong vs Godzilla, right? That’s what I remember hearing back when the previous Godzilla was released. I’d be down for that 100%.

    • That would be pretty awesome. I finally watched the trailer last night and the other “big baddies” looked pretty great. Not a fan of the giant spider-looking thing. I really hate spiders.

  5. I really enjoyed my movie going experience today, and not just because of the amazing trailers for Get Out (2017) and A Cure For Wellness (2017), both of which were way scarier than the actual film I went to see…I enjoyed myself because Bye Bye Man (2017) is entertaining shlock.

    This isn’t a movie for anyone looking for something new. This isn’t a movie for high expectations. This is a movie made for the laughs. Though unintentional, Bye Bye Man is ridiculous and goofy. It leans on the strengths of great films both old and new, but a little too hard, so hard in fact that the monster of this movie is revealed to be a silly Xerox of Freddy Krueger.


    If you’re squeamish about gore, you’re not going to have to worry about this movie making your skin wiggle. However, there’s still plenty of moments in this film that do manage to successfully creep, but none of those moments include the massive CGI dog. The bad CGI makes this pooch so out of place, it would be like having a fully colorized Fraggle following around Bela Lugosi throughout the entire film of Dracula (1931).

    The atmosphere of the house that our three protagonists move into has a dark resonating personality. Although it can be creepy, this home is equally just as silly. At times the life of this set reminds me of House (1986), especially when the printed wallpaper design of a deer suddenly grows a demonic dog head.


    The recurring phrase, don’t think it, don’t say it, wants to get into your head. It’s basically telling you to shut off your brain and let the film take you for a ride. Like Rob Zombie’s 31 (2016), if you’re trying to make sense of what’s going on, it’s going to take you out of the full experience. This isn’t something to muse on, it’s a pump and dump.


    Carrie-Anne Moss plays as Detective Shaw, a late story addition that’s there to strengthen an upcoming interrogation scene between the lead actor, Douglas Smith and herself. It’s an important scene that’s ultimately delivered well and momentarily puts some of the nonsense to rest so we can get real and have a glimpse into the real horror that’s being dealt with. The scene is over pretty quick, but it’ll shake you up a bit before throwing you back into the shlock.

    “WHAT DO YOU THINK I AM? A FLASHLIGHT?” – Best line in the film.

    Would I like a sequel? Hell yeah! And I hope it’s off-the-rails. I’m hoping they realize what they’re working with and decide to acknowledge the strengths of this film lay within the schlock. Then again, some of the best schlock is accidental and this is a prime example.

    5.0 Buy


  6. So I figured out where the title for The Bye Bye Man may have actually come from. There’s an episode of the show The League where our heroes discuss that as children, they’d come up with characters to scare each other, and as adults Kevin is still particularly haunted by “Bobbum Man”. Weird coincidence! Here’s a quick youtube clip of all the Bobbum Man mentions in the episode:

    • According to screenwriter Jonathan Penner he has never seen The League and according to Stacy Title, “We used the name as it came from the source material. A book called ‘The President’s Vampire, strange but true tales of the USA’ by Robert Damon Schneck, the chapter about The Bye Bye Man was in a chapter called ‘The Bridge to Body Island.’ So it comes from this non-fiction book. Not something we made up.” That doesn’t mean that Robert Damon isn’t a fan of The League. Except for the fact that the book was published in 2007 and the TV show didn’t premiere until 2009. So it’s actually much more likely that the character of The Bobbum Man was inspired by the either Damon’s book or (much more terrifyingly) by whatever the “true” story was that Damon was telling in the book. Yikes!

      • Working at a bookstore, when you guys mentioned this flick the first time, I immediatly picked it up. I’m horrible about waiting for films if I know that it’s based on a book. I was totally underwhelmed by the story itself, and most of the book. Mostly seemed like an anecdote the author was told over a dinner with his friends. Said freinds were also the creators of the story, which kind of ruined the “true story” aspect for me. Supposedly the events happened to these friends of his, which makes me automaticaly suspect of the story. They do seem convinced that the events happened to them, but it wasn;t enough to convince me that they didn’t just eat some bad seafood. All this being said, the idea of an urban legend like The Bye-Bye Man seems ripe to become a candyman-esque movie franchise. And, Josh, your review gives me hope that I would actually enjoy the movie more than the read. I realize this isn’t Horror Book Podcast (not a bad idea though maybe), so I’m sorry to bog you down with my little book review. As always, thank you for the stellar review and awesome show! Half way through and am going to savor these last couple hours!

        • Loved the book review! Thank you, Carnagelou. We have a listener that writes a horror book review column for a British horror magazine. If Jay would allow it, I’d have him come on and do a horror book review every Frankensteinian episode.

          So, just today we got a tweet with a link to the “true story” and my reaction was very similar to yours. It seemed a little thin. I will say, the true story has all of that exposition and backstory to the monster that would have explained a lot of the big question marks in the movie (like the sidekick creature).

          I’d actually high recommend listening to this if people have seen or are going to see TBBM. If clarifies a lot about the story that it looks like was cut from the film which could have made the movie a much richer experience. Or, we would have just complained about it like we did with Lights Out. Haha

  7. Hi guys, I’ve been a listener to the show for sometime now and I have to say you guys are my favourite podcast. I don’t know if it’s subtly brainwashing going on but I have found myself agreeing with Jay more and more as time goes by.

    I’m writing now on the comments boards for the first time so please be gentle. However I feel compelled to write after seeing Split. I don’t like spoilers but I will talk about a few issues I have with the film.

    The initial set up and premise of the film is genuinely interesting and starts off well. Things start to go terribly wrong just before the halfway point and by the time a certain director makes his obligatory cameo its to late.

    My major issue with the film lies in the appalling way it deals with the issue of child abuse. As a teacher whose responsibility is to deal with Safeguarding and Child Protection to sit there and see it handled in such a misogynistic manner just makes my blood boil. It treats its subject matter with all the care and subtly that a Benny Hill sketch address feminism. Not to go into spoilers but the total drivel of a certain character being “Pure” is outrightly offensive. Shyamalan handles this subject matter with all the deftness of a sledgehammer.

    The second issue I have is the gratuitous manner in which the young female cast is filmed. Yes cinema is by it’s very nature is a gratuitous medium. However this crosses over into an area that is not only uncomfortable but distasteful.

    My third issue is Mcavoy gives a stellar performance which is totally and utterly ruined by the ineptitude of M. Night Shyamalan.

    Sorry to rant but this film has really got to me.

    • Huw! First of all, thanks for commenting! Second, how could you possibly agree with Jay?

      I really appreciate your comments and I want to address them.

      ****** SPOILERS FOR SPLIT *******

      You said, “My major issue with the film lies in the appalling way it deals with the issue of child abuse. As a teacher whose responsibility is to deal with Safeguarding and Child Protection to sit there and see it handled in such a misogynistic manner just makes my blood boil.”

      At this point, I really had no idea what you were referring to. I’d like to hear more about this if I don’t address what your issue is.

      “The total drivel of a certain character being ‘Pure’ is outrightly offensive.”

      I mentioned in the spoiler section that I thought this was a “dangerous” philosophy. For me, particularly in regard to cutting. But, I think there is a chance that you are mis-reading M. Night here. I took it as hopeful. As though he was saying that if horrible things have happened to you, you’re not broken forever. That those awful experiences can become strengths. Of course, this philosophy can also be read in a very dark way to which I answer … “It is being spoken by the villain of the film. I don’t think we’re meant to necessarily agree with the villain. Maybe we’re supposed to empathize with his point, since he was also a victim of abuse, but we’re also supposed to understand that he’s insane, I think.”

      Then, you said, “The second issue I have is the gratuitous manner in which the young female cast is filmed. […] this crosses over into an area that is not only uncomfortable but distasteful.”

      I don’t disagree with you. I thought that was a bit weird, myself. Especially as Night is a guy with two daughters. I guess my assumption was jsut that it was either an expression of the place that McAvoy’s character was at OR that it is just a trope of the genre. I agree that is seemed mostly unnecessary to me and I don’t have a defense except to sat that it make the characters seem much more vulnerable in that state of undress. The other possible consolation there is that although the girls are supposed to be young teens, they were all over 18 (and are in their 20s).

      You also said “My third issue is Mcavoy gives a stellar performance which is totally and utterly ruined by the ineptitude of M. Night Shyamalan.”

      I can agree with you about the sexualizing of the “teens” and the potentially problematic approach to abuse, but I do not at all see how M Night was “inept” here. I found him masterful. I don’t want to be dismissive of your comments, I’d just like to hear more about why you think he was inept and what it was that specifically really got to you.

      Thanks again for commenting, buddy. This dialog and discussion is what it is all about, for me.

      • Hi Josh, thanks for responding. Sorry it’s taken me a while to get back to you.

        What really got me was the way that in order to tell his story M Night falls back on a number of cliches in relation to child sexual exploitation. The uncle character being the abuser. The fact the beast element of the story could be read as a mirroring of the leads experiences. This is a very blunt view of child sexual exploitation. It is an over simplified view of a exceptional complex issue. I feel that to use child abuse and self harm as a plot mechanism to save your final girl is crass.

        Anya Taylor-Joy gives a great performance, particularly when she has to deliver some awful lines. The line about “getting into trouble on purpose” is so clunky. It is also highlights a major flaw with M Nights approach to abuse. Any school where a child who was clearly displaying such classic symptoms of crisis has major child protection issues. Then for good measure and to heap it on his lead M Night throws in the self harm issue. My personal opinion is that it’s lazy and irresponsible and he approaches such a delicate subject like a bull at a gate.


        Which all feeds into my comment surrounding his ineptitude. The character of the physiatrist is so painfully written. How is it that this so called professional therapists is breaking down in tears every session. Sorry to repeat myself but the total drivel of the nonsense dialogue of being ‘Pure’ is outrightly offensive, irresponsible and misguided. By the time we get to the surprise cameo at the end I had totally lost it.

        McAvoy’s performance no matter how hard he works is totally kneecapped by a director who’s recent filmography with the odd exception has been disappointing.

        I will concede that M Night is technically masterful and this film has some moments that if not for my significant issues with using child abuse as a cheep thrill could have redeemed it.

        Josh I take on board your points entirely and can see exactly where you are coming from. But I’m sticking to my guns on this one. This film to use a good old welsh phrase I thought it was Sbwriel.

        • Huw! I’m glad you’re sticking to your guns. Thank you for responding. I’m still having a lot of trouble wrapping my head around some parts of your argument. I know that you’re a podcaster in your own right and so I feel really comfortable asking you on the show to discuss this topic before consulting the other guys. We’re planning a discussion of “disability” in horror and while this doesn’t fit exactly, I think we should tweak the theme in include this discussion. My only interest here is learning more about how you are experiencing the film. I’m sorry if it is frustrating to explain this to me like a child, but some of the concepts you’re bringing up are absolutely foreign to me and I think our audience would benefit from your point of view. Thanks again for responding and let’s talk about scheduling you for a show!

          • Hi Josh, I would love to come on the show and discuss Split from a Child Protection and Safeguarding point of view. In particular as the characters in the film are the age range of the pupils that I work with.

            My full job role is ALNCO which stands for Additional Learning Needs Coordinator. I have spent my entire teaching career working with young people with disabilities in particular autism. So I’m more than happy to discuss disability in film as well.

            In terms scheduling etc just say the time and I shall be there. The time difference between here in Pontypool in South Wales and you guys will be really interesting.

            Once again thanks for responding and I really look forward to hearing from and fingers crossed speaking to you soon. I’m a massive fan of the show and have the upmost respect for all you guys. All the best Huw

          • Sorry, super late to the party here. I just had to say that I quite enjoyed this discussion. I’ve heard/read the main plot points/spoilers, but haven’t seen the movie so I can’t quite chime in yet. In addition to being a little apprehensive about the triggering subject, I had a baby in December, so I haven’t been able to see as many movies in the theater as I normally would have. As I write this, though, it is out on DVD so I may rent it.

            This is a topic quite close to me…my older brother has been diagnosed with DID (among several other issues) stemming from some abuse he suffered as a child. While it developed late enough that both of us were out of the house and I have never witnessed any transitions, I know enough about what happens to him and what “caused” it that I feared this may be a triggering movie for me.

            I enjoyed hearing your guys’ reviews and am curious to see for myself how the disorder and the issue of abuse are handled by M. Night. I can’t say I’ve ever been super impressed by his subtlety, but I will reserve judgement for now.

            Looking forward to hearing the discussion of “disability” in horror. Sorry if it’s already been recorded, but I’m working on getting myself all caught up!

            • Great hearing from you, GrislyGal.

              First, congratulations on your baby! Judging by your avatar photo, you make cute ones. Hope you’re getting some sleep.

              So sorry to hear about your brother. Very curious to hear your take on the film after seeing it. “Subtlety” is defintely not the word that best describes this film, but I thought it worked, for the most part.

              Looking forward to hearing from more people who have experience with DID when we get into our disorder/disability episode(s). We have NOT recorded that episode yet and won’t for a little while, still, so please send us your thoughts on the representation of DID in Split after you see the film.

              Thanks for listening and for the comment!

              • Thank you! I’m pretty fond of my little monster. The husband and I are anxiously awaiting Halloween so we can dress up as a family rather than just a couple this year. And as a side note, your guys’ episode “Horror for Little Monsters” gave me a GREAT start to my 31 Days of Halloween list for family viewing, so thanks for that. We are indoctrinating him early!

                I will definitely be posting my thoughts on Split after I see it. I hope it works for me. I also tend to be a Shyamalan apologist–I actually enjoyed watching The Happening, even though it was incredibly dumb–so I really want to like Split. His handling of the subject matter just concerns me a little.

  8. I don’t have cable so most of the horror movie previews I see are through the trailers before other horror movies. I haven’t even heard of Bye Bye Man. I’m going to trust your review and see it this week.

    The Cure for Wellness reminds me a lot of Shutter Island. They seem to have a few similarities with the way it was shot and the atmosphere solely judging from the preview. I’m excited for this one as well.

    M. Night Shamalmading-dong lost of my respect with The Happening. (Truthfully, Lady in The Water was terrible too.) The Visit was pretty good although I felt he should have taken the story that the grandmother was telling a little further in a true “twist.” I hope Split does not disappoint.

    I will admit I absolutely loved Prometheus and I am glad the plot didn’t give everything away. People are getting lazy and need everything spelled out for them. We need more movies with ambiguous plots so we can actually have discussions about the meaning and intent. I agree that the new Alien movie doesn’t “wow us” in the preview but I am hoping they are saving some of the good stuff for the movie. Can’t stand when the entire movie is regurgitated through a preview instead of leaving us wanting to know more.

    And onto Cloverfield. I think this is my favorite found footage movie. I guess it just felt real to me. I enjoyed the commentary by the guy holding the video camera. The shakey camera didn’t really bother me and the movie made NYC seem small and claustrophobic.

    I loved The Blackcoat’s Daughter. My Review:
    I just finished watching THE BLACKCOATS DAUGHTER….

    First, I had no idea what this film was about and didn’t read any reviews or watch any trailers. It is rare that I see a movie without knowing anything about it. I recommend not looking into what this movie is about before watching. It will be a pleasantly horrific surprise. The cinematography and score give it an incredibly David Lynch mood similar to Twin Peaks and very much film noir, and oh so unsettling. The long camera stills on character’s faces creates an uncomfortable tension and an awkward closeness to what is happening in the film. I felt like I was feeling what the characters were feeling and it was really scary. I have to mention the score alone was incredibly eerie which set the mood magnificently for this film. I felt the score was so well-matched to what was happening in the film, almost to the same degree as score of The Shining. In fact, the build up in this film reminded me of a lot of The Shining.

    I like that every viewer can have a completely different experience because the story line is a bit vague. Not to the point where you have no idea what is going on, rather you are eagerly grasping every hint thrown your way. I felt like I wanted to figure the plot out before it was ultimately revealed and I kept trying but I didn’t manage to which was refreshing, especially because it wasn’t a huge plot twist with a crazy 180 degree unexpected turn. It made sense afterwards and I was completely satisfied.

    This is a slow burn with a build-up of dread that quite literally gave me anxiety. I think the pacing of this film might turn off some viewers as there aren’t many jump scares. It is so incredibly dark and ominous. If I had seen this a couple weeks ago it would have made it into top slot for sure. This movie psychologically scared (and probably scarred) me and I have a feeling it will stick with me for quite some time. I am still like, “what did I just watch?” And of course I watched it when I was home alone…

    I think the negative reviews are by people who expected a lame horror movie with jump scares where everything is spelled out for you and you don’t need to think much while watching.

    If you liked movies like “It Follows”, “The Witch”, and “Absentia” then you’ll probably love this.

    If 2017 can bring us half as many awesome horror movies as 1016 it will be a good year.

    I think The Girl With All the Gifts will be the biggest FAIL of the year. I don’t want to give anything away other than the ending did not make me enjoy the movie.

    I can’t wait for this year’s horror!

    • RE: Cloverfield. “I enjoyed the commentary by the guy holding the video camera.” That is a favorite comedian of mine, TJ MiIler. I’m mostly a fan due to his appearances on the Doug Loves Movies podcast, which I used to listen to all the time. His stand-up isn’t great, but he is a master improv / ad-libber. He mostly does voices for animated TV and movies like Gravity Falls, How to Train YourDragon and Big Hero 6, but he’s also on the HBO series Silicon Valley and he’s the hilarious (IMO) bartender in DeadPool. He was the star of that Office Christmas Party (which I didn’t see), but I wish he would do a horror movie.

    • Projectile Varmint-

      I’m a little scared that you might be going to see TBBM on my recommendation, since I seem to be in the extreme minority. I do think it’s a decent movie that is just getting people piling on, but my main recommendation this week would be Split. I think you’ll appreciate the psychological aspects of it.

      I’m with you that The Happening and Lady in The Water are bad. Split is not that. You should see it! And there is not a big twist, so don’t be waiting for that. It’s just a good movie.

      • I support every horror flick I can in the theaters It’s just such a different experience. As long as the ending isn’t like We Are Still Here, then it can’t be that bad 😉

        I’ll have to check out that comedian because he reminds me of the dry sarcastic humor I have with my friends. I am curious to hear your review of Blackcoats Daughter. I am sure you will love that one because you really liked It Follows. They are nothing alike but have that eerie feeling when you finish watching.

    • Projectile Varmint
      It makes me really sad when people totally dismiss M. Knight because he made a few bad movies (and yes, I’ll admit, they are really bad). But, because The Sixth Sense, Signs, Unbreakable, and The Village are SO GREAT, I can forgive the few bad movies he made and go into a new movie hopeful. I really liked Devil, The Visit, and LOVED Split. I especially love the twist at the end of his movies (I know most people are sick of it by now), but I hope you’ll see Split and remember how great he was! :) I don’t agree with Josh that there isn’t a big twist…there is a pretty big twist (actually more like a reveal) that shocked most people, and made my mouth drop.
      I love your review of The Blackcoats Daughter and can’t wait to see it. We have very similar movie tastes so I have come to trust your opinion!

  9. Also:
    I found a few more while I fell down a rabbit hole on Youtube…Don’t know if they are for real, but they all looked like it.

    Don’t Knock Twice


    The Terrible Two

    Before I Fall

    I am really excited for the new Netflix original movie I Don’t Feel at Home in This World Anymore Official. I think it’s a thriller comedy. Not really my thing but I like the actors so I will give it a shot.

  10. Jay, I’ll give it to you. I had a really tough time labeling Green Room a horror film, and the comparison of it to No Escape is apt. I didn’t hear any good counter arguments. I still haven’t seen No Escape, but I think we’re at a point with this show that everyone has to come up with their own definition of horror. I’m currently taking the route of inclusivity. I mean… the freakin’ Neon Demon was on my top 10 horror films of last year, and that is hardly horror at all.

    • I totally understand folks not classing Green Room as a horror film. I had trouble with that too though I try to be as inclusive as I can when it comes to stuff on the fringes so it ended up in my top 5 of the year. That said I think the comparison to No Escape is a massive stretch on Jay’s part and I imagine there were no real counter arguments because Doc and Josh are just tired of contending with Jay’s stubbornness.

      Jay was basically just breaking the movies down to the most basic components and drawing a parallel from there but that’s no different than saying that “Star Wars” features a situation where people are in peril just like Friday the 13th so Star Wars is a slasher film. The logic is faulty. I haven’t seen No Escape but I’ve asked around and apparently it has next to no gore which is something that definitely pushes Green Room in more of a horror direction, the gore in that movie is explicit, savage and gut-churning. Also, premise alone, when considered properly, dictates that Green Room fills out more horror check points; isolated location, group of friends picked off one by one in gruesome ways, seemingly indefatigable threat. And there’s a big difference between the callous, relentlessness of murderous skinheads and just getting caught up in a fray with rioting locals in a foreign country. And if those locals are depicted as relentless and indefatigable murderers then that’s probably more xenophobic than tonally horrific. I’ll put it this way; if all the skinheads in Green Room were wearing clown masks it would seem like a horror movie. If all the rioting locals in No Escape were wearing clown masks it would probably seem like an Asian Juggalo convention got out of hand.

        • No intent to offend, Kagan. I’m just passionate and I tend to react to people with the same level of intensity or respect or humor that I feel they are putting out there.

          I don’t think I’m any different on the comment boards than I am on the show. I guess it’s just less loveable when A. You can’t hear the tone of my voice and B. My ire isn’t directed at Jay.

          I’d say both of the comments of yours that I reacted to were a bit jerky as well. I was responding in kind.

          To say that none of the rest of us have good arguments, first of all, and then to say that you haven’t even seen the movie?! Hahaha. What?! I don’t think I’m being a jerk to say that’s ludicrous. Or if I am, I’m not intending to be.

          • Wolfman-

            “Less lovable” made me lol. I think your arguments are well backed and you don’t put anyone down whilst still being passionate about your pov. This is one of the reasons I respect your reviews so much. I don’t think you were being a jerk, just snarky. Nothing wrong with snarky.

      • Yeah, sorry for calling you a jerk Josh.

        Even if what I said was ludicrous, I just wasn’t prepared for your tone. I’m less likely to engage in conversation when it hops directly to, what clearly came across to me as, insults. But again, I’m sorry. You and I have gone 0 to 60 on film talk before, and I’m not always prepared for it. I do the same thing when I feel passionately about film, but my thoughts and arguments become much less impactful when I’m mad, which is why I had to wait a day to write this.

        Anyway, I see what you guys are saying. I realize that plots can be reduced down, and being that I have not seen No Escape, I don’t know how much Jay is actually cherry picking. This more stems from me thinking Green Room is barely horror FOR ME. I feel similar to the way Dino does. I wanted to include Green Room on my horror list mainly because, it’s a 10/10, and I want to include it in the discussion we have at this podcast. But no matter what you guys say, when I experienced Green Room for the first time, it was a dark, gritty, brutal, action, thriller. But because I was being inclusive on my 2016 list I was pleased to put it at #2 on my list last year.

        I guess to try and say what I had initially said in a less charged way: I can understand where Jay is coming from with his argument, but I get why you guys vehemently disagree with him. Having not seen the film, his argument seemed sound, but I suppose with additional information his reasoning and claim may be totally faulty.

        • “Even if what I said was ludicrous, I just wasn’t prepared for your tone.”

          I just think you may have misread my tone.

          That’s as much my fault as yours. And I am truly sorry for offending. It wasn’t my intent. I thought it was funny, but it’s not funny when feelings are hurt.

    • Kagan, I promise you, the only reason you think the comparison of Green Room to No Escape is apt is for the very reason you mention – you still haven’t seen No Escape.

      I think Josh said it best on the show that you can distill any movie synopsis to sound like horror, or even to sound similar to another movie. It’s like lying with statistics, another thing our Jason loves to do.

      The fact of the matter, though, is that Jason’s boom-goes-the-dynamite joke completely ignores the actual tone and intention of the films in question. No Escape is unquestionably an action/thriller in tone. Are some of the events of the film horrific? Sure. But the motivation for those horrific actions is socio-political revolution. It’s essentially one big violent protest.

      Green Room, on the other hand, is at the very least arguable as being horror in tone. The inciting incident is ***SPOILERS FOR GREEN ROOM*** a random murder, a crime of passion, that Anton Yelchin’s character mistakenly stumbled upon. From there, the horrific incidents are deceptive in nature and intended purely to eliminate the witnesses. There isn’t a political motivation involved or a message that is trying to be sent to incite change – they simply want to kill all witnesses.***END SPOILERS*** Moreover, the overall tone of the film is dark, gruesome and unapologetically brutal. All of this adds up to a compelling argument for Green Room as a horror film.

      For the record, I fall slightly on the “Green Room is horror” side of the discussion, but I certainly do not fault those who disagree. It’s borderline, imo.

      No Escape, however, is unquestionably an action/thriller. I am all for being inclusive with our horror genre classifications, but there is no reasonable argument for that movie to be horror. I love Jason, but he’s essentially become a caricature of himself in continuing to argue it as such.

      • I would also like to add that the main reason Green Room did not make my top 10 horror list of 2016 is because it doesn’t work as well as a horror film to me. So, while I do accept it as horror, it is not as successful as horror for me. In other words, I consider it a better film than Lights Out, which I had ranked #10, but not as effective to me as a horror film.

        I don’t know if any of that^ makes sense.

        But No Escape is still not horror. [period]

  11. I’m not finished listening to this episode, but Jay, I would genuinely be really appreciative if you would stop being so crusty about paranormal horror. I wouldn’t bring it up, but it’s been your mantra for a really long time. I get that it isn’t your bag. I really do! But, why not be positive about the films you’re excited about, and not feel it necessary to make sour comments about others just because they are paranormal. You can still make your voice be heard about your own horror sensibilities without saying disparaging things about what other people like. I love paranormal horror films along with real life horror! And I totally get where your’e coming from. Like… I have to come out of the closet here and say that most zombie movies aren’t necessarily my thing. I love the classics, every now and then I see a 28 Days Later or something, but by in large, I don’t get excited about them. I don’t find it necessary to take cuts at them whenever I hear a new one is coming out. I’m just sayin’

      • Yes! This is what I think each time I hear Jay bag on paranormal horror. In my mind, “ghost stories” are such a timeless, elemental component of the horror genre. I understand that we have had an uptick in them in recent years and that many of the films have been of varying quality, but it’s odd to act like it’s this flash in the pan subgenre that is going to die out anytime soon. Obviously, I’m a bit biased myself, as paranormal movies are the only horror films that still get to me these days, but it’s mind-boggling to think that a horror fan could be so against ghost tales. Different strokes, I suppose

    • Ghost stories and the paranormal are probably what shaped me into a horror fan at an early age. Supernatural horror is a great way for me to experience fear and suspense when I need an escape from the terror of the real world. Thanks for stepping up to defend it Kagan.

      Also, I share your feelings about zombie films. I love the early Romero movies and a couple of the zombie comedies, but generally I tend to skip them. I get why they are loved, but I am personally more drawn to slashers and ghost stories.

    • WHAT?!?!! You don’t like Zombie movies?

      This is WAR!!! I’m joining up with the Jay Brigade… Dagnabbit Jay, Change your name to Jade so we can be a rhyme scheme… Jade Brigade. BOOYAH!!!

      Anyway, its the ghosties verse the zombies….. ies… Winners get to eat the Wolfies.

      • Can’t we just have both though? I want zombie films to keep coming. I just might not be first in line to see them.

        Night of the Living Dead is one of my favorite horror films, and I love most of the other Romero films too. Especially Day of the Dead! I don’t have hate for the sub-genre, I just don’t have the same appreciation for it that people like Kyle Bishop do. Zombies have just never scared me is all.

    • Jason seems to be getting increasingly crusty as he ages.

      I think Jason is conflating his ire for supernatural movies with that of bad movies. He admits to liking several supernatural movies. There just happens to be a proliferation of supernatural films at the moment, which naturally leads to there being several sub-par supernatural films.

      • Agreed! And I do wish there could be more of a balance. I think Jay is wanting something that I also want. I wish there were more quality slashers and monster movies! But then again, reviewing my top 10 list from last year, it was really balanced across sub-genres. I really can’t complain about the final result.

        • Yeah… I don’t necessarily want to say that we’re in a golden age for horror, but the genre is definitely firing on (almost) all cylinders at the moment.

      • I think I am getting crusty as well. Before I’m toast I would add that my unique perspective as an atheist really affects how I view supernatural movies. My skepticism sometimes distracts me from a good time. To me supernatural-based horror flicks are entertaining, but if I want to feel truly afraid then I turn to slashers or more grounded-types of horror flicks. *Spolier* I loved “The Boy” because of the ending and it turned an interesting film into something else that to me was way more effective. So as much as I hate to say it I understand Jay’s ire. And while I want more entertaining supernatural movies, I don’t want them to dominate at the expense of others. Different strokes for different folks y’all.

        • FranktheFiend I am actually an atheist as well. I don’t believe in demons, ghosts, possession, etc. But for some reason, I still find paranormal horror scary. I think it’s because I have such fond memories of being scared by ghost stories as a kid. Just using my imagination and thinking… how scary would it be if demons were actually real?! I’ve been an atheist all my life, but I still love me a good ghost story!

          I think it’s also because supernatural is escapism for me. Like, sometimes real life horror can be too mean spirited and sadistic for me to “have fun” with it. I mean… I know people get murdered and tortured in real life, and sometimes I like having a break from that. Paranormal horror is often just a harmless, yet very thrilling, roller coaster ride.

          • I can totally relate in that when a paranormal film is effective and actually scares me then usually it relates back to my childhood fears and I was way less skeptical back then. I actually prefer a good demonic paranormal flick vs a ghost flick with ambiguous origins. Sometimes when I listen to or read reaction I wonder about how certain sub- genres are viewed based on these worldviews. But anyway, really enjoyed your reply and your take as a fellow non- believer.

          • I identified as an Atheist for years though I’m more inclined to consider myself Agnostic now as the feel like the older I’ve gotten the more I’ve become aware that there are a great many things out there that my brain probably couldn’t even comprehend. But that’s the element of supernatural horror that really gets to me. Realistic horror probably disturbs me more but paranormal stuff lingers in my mind and really spooks me out. It always bugs me when Jay says he wouldn’t be afraid of ghosts because they often pose less of a physical threat because that seems to be totally missing the point. The horror from supernatural movies comes from the idea that if you did witness something truly paranormal and malevolent then your entire worldview and perception of reality would be irreversibly altered. You would have to live the rest of your days in constant fear of the unpredictability of reality. That’s endlessly more psychologically chilling to me than the more bog-standard physical threats; We already know murderers exist, so even if we witnessed a murder, as awful as that would be, our understanding of reality would not be altered whereas even the most benevolent ghostly encounter might tear down the walls of sanity themselves. So I don’t prescribe to the idea that supernatural films only have an effect on those with religious backgrounds. But as FranktheFiend says; different strokes.

          • David,
            If I am being honest I would not consider myself a hard atheist because sometimes “I want to believe”. That being said, I have thought about the point you just raised. Here I am going about my life rejecting the possibility of ghosts and demons, but paranormal horror films treat these entities as fact. So every time I watch one I do think about how shocking and disorienting it would be to experience such things. When those kinds of films are effective to me it is when they allow my imagination to question whether such ghouls exist and make me paranoid to open my eyes when I’m alone in a dark room. The psychological effect can be maddening as I try to rationalize away those feelings. So I must say I agree whole-heartedly!

          • Let me clarify that I agree whole-heartedly when such films are effective. I still hold that for me non-paranormal horror flicks tend to be more effective on the whole. :)

  12. Split’s probably going to make it to my top 10 films of the year–horror and in general. The ending pissed me off, purely because I want to know how much Willis was paid for that. But yeah, dope movie. I’d say 8/10 underground zoo compounds.

  13. Mid-listening note: As someone going to college in Madison in the fall, I can confirm that the Bye Bye Man’s setting is wayyy off (that’s a given, seeing as it’s filmed in another city, but just a side note).

    • Thanks, Fiona. I’ve only been to the downtown area of Madison on State and down by the water – and in Winter – so I thought it might be a little different outside of town in the suburbs or something. Absolutely love Madison, though!

    • I wouldn’t say the setting was “definitely” Cleveland, either. It just looked like a typical suburban setting to me. It was filmed about 20 minutes from where I live, but I don’t normally frequent that area of town.

      There was a nice little Easter egg for Cleveland locals, though. During the kitchen scene after the party and before the seance, Elliot is drinking a Fat Head’s beer, which is a local Cleveland brewery.

  14. I’ve never been more excited or surprised by a film ending than I was for, Split. I literally grabbed my wife’s arm and said, (probably too loudly for a crowded theater), “HOLY SHIT!!!”

    Loved it.

    • Had the exact same reaction, Ashley. I mean I didn’t grab your wife’s arm, but I did have a ‘Holy Shit’ look on my face.

    • ******** SPOILERS FOR SPLIT ********
      I’m sincerely happy that Unbreakable fans enjoyed that moment at the end. I think my biggest problem with it was that I was into Split WAAAAY more than I am into Unbreakable. Unbreakable is a cool take on a super hero story, but I prefer the horror and I thought that ending undercut it a bit and was just kind of distracting. If he makes another film, all will be redeemed, I guess.


  15. Fun episode to kick off 2017 guys. I’ve made it part of my new year resolution to keep up with new releases. We certainly have an interesting year ahead.


    I was really enjoying this film up until the supernatural element, then the Willis appearance made my blood boil! Cannot fault the performances, Mcavoy was brilliant. Interesting concept too

    3 and a half out of 5 (I’ve always preferred the 5 star rating)

    • Finished the episode and so glad Wolfman picked up on the faults of Split which annoyed me also. Clearly I was less forgiving. I do fully agree this film stays with you for days.

      • I could see myself dropping it to a 9/10 in the cold light of day, but I was riding a high of just thinking about this movie so much following my screening. Still, I think the film was incredible. Sounds like we mostly agree on the problems.

  16. This episode was cracking me up! For a minute there, I thought HMP the Musical might happen. Also, I had to look up “I was a Teenage Wereskunk” right after listening to this. Drew and I may end up watching it some night.

    I had a few thoughts about the mention of a possible Suspiria remake releasing this year. I think the first time I’d heard of a potential remake was about seven or eight years ago, and my initial reaction was one of opposition. Now, even though the original is a dear favorite of mine, I would be interested in seeing a well done update of this film. I think a new version would absolutely need Bava-esque lighting (like in The Neon Demon), and a great atmospheric score (like the original), and it could also be made with younger ballet students as had been originally intended. I think younger students would make the plot more threatening and give the story a bit of a Hansel and Gretel vibe. There are elements from some more recent films, such as Berberian Sound Studio, and The Strange Color of Your Body’s Tears, that bring Susipira to mind and give me hope that a thoughtful and well crafted remake could be possible. I’m not sure what we will get though, if anything ever gets beyond the early development stage.

    On another note, I recently came across a micro budget indie Australian horror movie due to release this summer featuring a cabin in the woods and a demonic unicorn. It’s called Tarnation. I will probably be checking this out when it’s available.


    • “This episode was cracking me up! For a minute there, I thought HMP the Musical might happen.”

      Between Doc’s rendition of Nature Boy was pretty magnificent.

    • Agreed, this was a funny episode. Jay had me lol-ing all the way to and from work. What a cornball!

      Speaking of remakes, is there a HMP remake episode? There are few remakes I think are amazing like Texas Chainsaw, Dawn of the Dead, and Amityville. I think it takes some gusto to remake a classic horror film and some talent to make it decent. I feel like horror fans are some of the most critical fans out there that are very protective of their genre.

      • Remakes are something we’ve discussed a lot, but we’ve never done an episode dedicated to remakes. I’d actually be really interested in doing that. I agree with everything you said about remakes, PV.

    • I love everything you are saying about a Susperia remake, Allyson. I think it could be really good.

      I watched I Was a Teenage Were Skunk immediately after the recording (did not make it to Killer Piñata, yet). Couldn’t help myself once I saw the Were Skunk art. Sadly, it was not great. It started out okay and could have been interesting if it had committed to the John Waters thing it seemed like it was attempting. Then it becomes more Lost Skeleton of Cadavra or a much lower budget Psycho Beach Party. Then, it just becomes a modern wink-to-the-camera indie comedy hipster thing that I’d expect in a skit from Garfunkel and Oates or Comedy Bang bang or something. That was disappointing. Still kind of funny, but in a less interesting way.

      I will review it on the show, soon.

  17. I recently rewatched the entire Child’s Play series and I was amazed to discover that they are all excellent to just watchable/decent (Part 3). The third installment is the low point, Bride of Chucky is hilarious and Seed is just insane and as strange as that film is, I appreciated it more on a second viewing. Curse is better even if the puppetry took a tiny step backward.

    I hope the three of you will consider watching them all because I really think you’ll be pleasantly surprised to discover that the Child’s Play series, quality wise, has endured far better than nearly all of the other popular franchises. In fact, it’s better off than any of the other big guys: Jason, Freddy, Michael, Pinhead and Leatherface have all had a rough go many times, and with creator Don Mancini navigating Chucky’s way the entire time (who is his best friend at Universal?!), the series is really, really solid, and not disappointing in the least.

    • Hmmm … I’ve just never been a Chucky fan, so it isn’t a case of holding-up as much as winning me over. If we do a franchise review, we’ll have to have you on, Levi. Or a lot of input from some serious Chucky fans.

      • I always get disappointed with the lack of love for Chucky. My love of the series is based on nostalgia and I don’t think I could separate that even now that the first film is almost 30 years old. The series was out at the same time as Hasbro’s My Buddy doll which for me only added to the effectiveness because my parents had bought me one for Christmas and I refused to ever take it out of the box. As an adult my mother decided to open the doll and now has it displayed in her living room with some other dolls and it still gives me the creeps to this day. My wife has an irrational fear of living dolls and refuses to watch the Child’s Play series, but she would probably watch them with me if I said I was watching them to follow along with the podcast. Do me a solid guys. I’ll promise to support every thriller/drama that Jay says is horror if ya’ll will do a franchise review.

    • the best part of the Chucky series is it doesn’t over stay it’s welcome, each movie is enjoyable and not just a money making ploy. Ive got to rewatch these again, thanks for bringing them up! Would be great to hear on the podcast

  18. Pitchfork-
    Avoid. 2/10
    I found it awful. Acting was sub-par and overacting in most scenes. Most of the scenes I felt telegraphed and poorly written/executed.
    The killer had some moments, but the ending was wretched. Director/cinematographer had some “neat” angles/shots, but with some originality came same shot/setup done several times.
    Effects were poor, it was unwatchable at times.
    I thought, yes, 80’s retro feel slasher.
    It’s awful.

    • I actually really liked Pitchfork. I gave it a 6/10 and marked it a low priority rental for slasher fans. The killer was fantastic at making animalistic movements and sounds, plus the weird ass marsupial mask grew from being stupid to creepy as you saw more of him. Overall this movie has a lot of heart as a slasher. It reminded me a little bit of the vibe in Behind The Mask The Rise of Leslie Vernon. Though I will agree first kill was awful, the other kills weren’t too shabby. Plus pitchfork kills are just bloodt fun. The camera angels were also brilliant.

      • I have to add I really don’t like slashers, so it has to have something really special in it for me to like it. Let’s just say I like slashers as much as Jay likes supernatural horror.

        • What would you consider to be a good slasher? I feel as if there’s some sort of slasher sub genre for everyone so am curious.

            • Actually, Scream is my favorite as well, first slasher I ever saw and I rewatch all 4 of them every few months. What about Scream do you like? There are quite a few slashers from the 90s that have a similar vibe such as Urban Legends

          • So I will say it, I didn’t like Split. I often watch Signs once or twice a year because I love the concept and acting in it. I really enjoyed the 6th sense too. I watched the visit twice but thought it was the weaker of the 3. But Split sealed the deal that I am not down with his movies anymore. I feel like he relies too much on trying to shock the audience. I get that’s his schtick but it doesn’t do it for me anymore. I can see why people enjoyed the movie but it just wasn’t for me.

  19. If we are going to call a film horror because you can put yourself in that situation and it would be horrific or a survival horror situation then I’m putting forward blah blah land , because if I was trapped in that traffic with all that singing and dancing , well let’s just say I can’t think of a lot more horrifying place to get stuck, and longer your there the worse it gets.
    I’m just saying

  20. I’m almost finished with this episode – great jobs guys! you all had me really cracking up at the Teenage Were-skunk part.

    Mister Watson of Horror Corridor did a great episode were he covered the “Blackcoat’s Daughter” and other films related to entities and exorcisms:


    Just had to post that here!

    I am really looking forward to Get Out, Alien Covenant, and a few others after listening to this episode. doesn’t look like 2017 is going to rival 2016 for horror, though…but I could be wrong.

    More comments to come when I’m done with the episode.

    • Thanks for posting Dustin’s link. I have been meaning to get around to listening to the show for awhile now. I’ve only listened to one episode and am jealous of the preparation he puts in. I’ve often thought that my reviews would be improved a great deal if I prepared a few ideas beforehand. Haha

      I ended up watching I Was a Teenage Were Skunk that night after the podcast. Haha. It’s pretty bad, but I look forward to discussing it on the show.

      Get Out is my most anticipated film for the year, so far, closely followed by The Devil’s Candy, Colossal, I Am a Hero, and Safe Neighborhood.

      • Yeah, his episodes are amazing. I often have to break them up into intevals because they’re so information heavy – and I can’t be thinking that hard while on the 110 in LA…danger zone!

        You guys made my last drive into LA for SoCal free musuem day at LACMA so much fun though. I went into work in a great mood because of all the laughing, (and then my happy face promptly left the building as 28,000 people flooded LACMA). Anyway, thanks again guys!

        I totally looked up I was a Teenage Wereskunk, and was about to watch it – but got totally distracted with cleaning. Still plan on watching it though, and I look forward to your review Josh.

        Still need to see half of these trailers…and Split, too. I skipped the last 15 minutes of your guys’ review when I heard one of you say that “the less you know going into it, is better.” Still willing to give M. Night a solid chance on this…

    • Bonnie! Thanks a TON for your kind words about Horror Corridor! You know how I feel about you, though, homie! Ha ha. You’re awesome. And thank YOU, Josh, for the kind words as well.

      So… I know this is quite a late response, but I just watched Split tonight, and am finally feeling brave enough to venture onto the comments section here since I don’t have to be afraid of spoilers anymore. LOL.

      All I can say is… GREAT episode. I need to listen to the spoiler section now. Much love, everyone!

  21. What are everyone’s top 5 horrror villain match up movies? I came up with this thought after realizing a Ghostface vs Leatherface movie would be a face-off….gotta love puns. I’m curious to hear what other people think. But some of the on screen matchups I’d love to see (even if not possible) are:
    1. Freddy vs Jason vs Ash
    2. Pinhead vs Jigsaw
    3. Michael Myers vs Jason
    4. Pennywise vs The Thing
    5. Michael Myers vs Victor Crowley

    • Wow, are those ever out of the box! I have literally NEVER thought about this before, but if pressed I would go with:

      1. Frankenstein vs The Wolf Man (but for real, this time)
      2. Michael Myers vs Jason Voorhees
      3. Ghostface vs Brandon James
      4. The Thing vs Marybeth Louise Hutchinson (The Faculty)
      5. Critters vs Gorilla Wolf Motherf***ers (Attack the Block)

      Honorable Mentions: The Mist vs The Fog and Wallace (Tusk) vs The Human Centipede

    • Fun question, Slashley! Hm…

      1. The Thing vs. The Blob (80’s versions)
      2. Pinhead vs. Wishmaster
      3. Pennywise vs. Candyman
      4. Michael vs. Freddy vs. Jason
      5. Mary Reilly (Dead Silence) vs. The Woman in Black

      And just for old school shits and giggles: The Black Scorpion vs. the Them! Ants, and the 1961 Mysterious Island creatures vs. Journey to the Seventh Planet monsters.

  22. ARGHHGHGH!!! This conversation again? Jay, I feel like you are just never going to let this go. You want to call “No Escape” a horror film, that’s fine. But here’s my take on it:

    No Escape is an action thriller. It is an intense thrill ride and this is a point of contention that I’ve been having for quite some time with many horror fans. That is… FEAR does not equal HORROR. SUSPENSE is not HORROR. By your logic, North by Northwest has just been labelled “horror” rather than suspense. But, let me be more specific… the characters in “No Escape” are trapped by geopolitical events rather than personal- they happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, which in itself is not horror. They experience moments of fear and heart-pounding escapes while surrounded by hostile forces… but some of those forces aren’t as hostile as others. The characters must fight and run to survive, but the danger is never truly one of true horror. They are afraid of being killed. They’re not afraid of anything else… death is quick, death is immediate, and death is a certainty.

    So why is Green Room horror? It’s not because of the claustrophobia or the danger the characters are in- it’s the NATURE of the danger. The movie has action beats because they are trying to survive, but those action beats are punctuated by moments of real HORROR… these kids are torn apart. They aren’t just being killed here. It’s inhumanly cruel, graphic, and HORRIFYING. It’s not a simple matter of “live or die”. It’s extremely visceral and flat out monstrous to see what that band goes through and what Patrick’s character is so casually capable of. Additionally, no one is really going to make it out of the film with a real life to look forward to. Survival isn’t really walking away with the same life you always lived before… getting away is not going to be freedom, it’s not going to be salvation, it’s just another step in what is going to be a long process of picking up the pieces. The tone of Green Room is so very bleak with very little hope for anyone when all is said and done. For someone who is always trying to define horror, I give you these two films as a perfect example of where the line is crossed and where it is not.

    If “No Escape” included scenes of graphic violence… gore, mutilations, beheadings, bodies dragged through the streets, tortured and with villains of true sadistic madness, then I would absolutely agree with you one hundred percent of the way. But it doesn’t… it’s just a political thriller with a personal attachment. I get why you were afraid… any family man would be. They’d be terrified in that situation… but they’d be terrified if it were a natural disaster and I don’t see you rushing to label “Twister” a horror film. Are you?

    • If graphic violence is what separates horror from thriller, wouldn’t that make Saving Private Ryan and Braveheart horror films? (Reading Noel Carroll is starting to have a big impact on my approach to horror. At the moment I’m even in the middle of putting together a lecture for my Intro students on the psychology of horror movies, with Carroll featuring prominently)

    • Redcap, I essentially presented the same argument above to Kagan before seeing your response down here. So, obviously, we’re right.

      However, I disagree with what you said at the end, that if No Escape included scenes of graphic violence then you would agree that it is horror. For me, that still wouldn’t change the fact that the motivation for these violent acts is socio-politically driven. Their intention is to incite political change, not to mame and murder. It’s just a big, violent protest. Increasing the graphically violent content in No Escape would just make it a more intense action/thriller.

      • I kind of meant all those things at once and with that intent… Saving Private Ryan utilizes gore and violence, yes. But the tone is far different. It’s not about horrifying us as an audience… It’s just about gaining sympathy.

  23. Five Movies I’m looking forward to this year:

    Friday the 13th… I am a Jason Voorhees fan, through and through. I like him more than Mikey, Freddie, or any of the rest and so I’ll take even the crappiest reboots or remakes or reimagining any time of the day for pure nostalgia value. I’ll still crap all over it if it deserves it, but I’m also looking forward to that.

    Rings: Call me sentimental, it still scares the crap out of me and creeps me out.

    Belko Experiment: I just love the writer, the premise, and the trailer. It looks like a sort of twist on “Battle Royale” set in The Office.

    Alien: Covenant – Love Alien. Love the series. I even enjoyed Prometheus.

    The Mummy. : It’s just… I’m hesitant but I’m also really eager.

    • I loved The Ring, and cannot wait for this one. I hope they keep that indie vibe that the first one had. Naomi Watts really added something special to that movie. Love her. I am hoping CGI won’t ruin this one. The preview has me amped.

      • I think I’m the only person on the planet that doesn’t love The Ring or think it’s particularly scary. Love Naomi Watts though.

        • I think The Rings niche has been overtaken by technology and I don’t just mean that VHS tapes and landline phones are outdated. I just think it is harder to justify more films in the series since paranormal cinema has already incorporated all the interesting notes it plays.

    • Redcap, and Projectile Varmint – could not agree more on being excited for Rings. The Ring was a great film…I especially love that Rick Baker was the principal SFX artist on the 1st dead girl in the closet, and you can find footage of him arranging her. Pretty rad.

      Can’t wait for Alien Covenant, too.

  24. Regarding “The Bye Bye Man”- I was very middle of the road on this film and will post a link to my review on my blog below. But a couple of issues I wanted to tackle here with regards to the film itself:


    Having read “the Bridge to Body Island” years ago it never really struck me as memorable and the film did not stir the slightest of memories, so I paid the story a revisit. It’s a bit of folklore where three friends rent a house and use a Ouija Board to contact a spirit calling itself “The Bye Bye Man”, who proceeds to tell them his story of being a railroad drifter killer who uses the eyes and tongues of his victims to create a companion creature that he continues to feed long after his own apparent death. The three friends then commit a murder suicide pact.

    I thought the Leigh Whannel portion of the film was excellent and would have preferred to have seen that movie, as opposed to the story about the three friends and the rest of the story that took place. And I can see what Josh took from the film, but my own experience was less enthusiastic. And I really wanted to like the film.


    • I’m with you on the Leigh Whannel portion being the best and most interesting part. I’d have liked to see that play a bigger role in the rest of the film. I think some of the mythology from the original story could have added some real depth as well. I liked the Freddy Krueger aspect of this character and I thought the ending (which was essentially the ***SPOILERS*** same ending as Lights Out ***SPOILERS ***) was done much better here. I think all of those additions could have really elevated the film, but I also think that all of my issues with the film could have been fixed in editing, so that’s pretty minor, in my opinion. So curious if there will be a director’s cut that restores some of these things or if they were ever shot.


    As I was watching Split, I felt myself dreading the inevitable “twist” that would have to happen. I’ve never been a fan of M. Night’s sudden “revelations” in films and this one seemed to be in high gear toward accomplishing another car crash for me. When the psychologist said that his “real name” was Kevin, I immediately started to think that “Casey” was really “K.C.”… since the name isn’t spelled out on the screen. I thought we were for sure headed toward the another Identity or, much worse, “My Blood Valentine” cheating.

    I was incredibly relieved when the film finally unraveled and there was no true twist other than in the narrative of the story. Even the stinger at the end could be ignored if one didn’t want to consider that as part of the overarching story (but I liked it).


    • Yeah, I think it’s reductive to … reduce … M Night’s films to the twists. His good films (which I’d say he’s about 50 – 50 right now) are quality all of the way through. Acting, blocking, wardrobe, lighting, cinematography … it’s not just a moment and I hope this film will go a ways in expanding the conversation about his films.

      • I think he’s a very talented director who gets in his own way a little too often. The acting is often very good, blocking, wardrobe, lighting… I think those things are functionally great. I think his greatest weakness is his writing… his dialogue is very stilted and rarely sounds like real people talking. As I’ve said in other medium, I really REALLY liked Unbreakable, but I haven’t really enjoyed the other films in his filmography (that I have seen, I haven’t seen the Visit yet.) I find the “twist” far too often overshadows and undermines the effort of his work.

        • I guess my point is that it overshadows his work if you’re just waiting for it the whole time, but not if you forget it and just let a storyteller take you on a ride. I do think he’s a great storyteller, in the old campfire sense. I’d agree that his dialog is not his strong suit, but that has been less noticeable for me in the films with stronger actors. A Mark Wahlberg isn’t as good at making that dialog feel real in the way that a Betty Buckley is.

  26. A little surprised I haven’t heard mention of Sadako vs. Kayako, maybe I missed it in what is an epic episode at four hours long. So I just rewatched Sadako vs. Kayako (Ring vs Grudge) while I still have the free week trial from the streaming horror service Shudder, and I loved it more the second time. I posted about this on the previous comment board, but was like comment 482 or something, so I want to make sure that the joy I had watching this movie is known. Being a huge fan of mash-ups from A&C meet Frankenstein to Freddy vs Jason to Scooby Doo meets the Harlem Globetrotters I was pretty excited to see what would come from this. It’s pretty weird, with some creepy moments and some outlandish CG that actually was all pretty endearing to me. The story is bizarre, no surprise there, but is handled pretty well through some light comedy and clever intersection of the two franchises. It also seemed to move a little more briskly than the original J-Horror classics which I appreciated. Having really enjoyed last years The Wailing quite a bit, I really liked the introduction of a strange Shaman type character and his even stranger sidekick. Also the sound design was just as off the wall as the rest of the movie, especially the scenes in the “Murder House” that houses Kayako from Ju-On(the grudge). I’d give this an 8.5 out of 10. Excited to hear what other people think.

      • Really enjoyed the review from your blog redcapjack, and especially one from someone with more knowledge of Japanese cinema. I was wondering about some of the differences you mentioned, especially the two days instead of seven This one was not as effective as the originals for sure, but it totally fit into the “junk-food cinema” category for me, not necessarily the healthiest thing to digest but tasted good at the time.

        • I tend to agree… again, I’m comparing it to a lot of other movies I tend to watch. I also tend to be very harsh in my criticism. All movies basically start at around a 5 for me and slide up or down depending on the content… I’m probably being a little unfair in my review but only because the previous movies set such a high bar. And I did, genuinely, have fun while watching it.

          But I’ll stand by my initial thoughts for now.

    • I’m halfway through, and I am really digging it! I’m impressed what direction they have taken it. When I saw the trailer I thought it would be really dumb, but I have to say that I’m pleasantly surprised!

      • Pleasantly surprised is the best kind of surprise! Couldn’t agree more. Did that reaction hold up ’til the end for you?

  27. Hey all…I finally listened to the new episode and loved it. I love the depth to which all the hosts went to to inform the listeners of upcoming movies. I look forward to I was a Teenage Wereskunk and The Pinata Massacre. I was curious why no mention at all of The Darktower. Is it because it is not considered horror (more fantasy) despite being written by Stephen King or because we are not sure it will be released in 2017?
    I also wanted to say I watched the movie Parasites, Am not sure it is late 2017 or early 2017 but felt compelled to mention it. Coming in I knew it was low budget and was not expecting a lot but it ended up growing on me as the movie went on. It turned to be a survival movie in the NOTLD mold. It is about 3 college kids in a bad beighbourhood Los Angeles and what happens when they get car trouble. I won’t put out any spoilers in but is worth a watch for those who like urban blight and social decay. Here is the trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgGz7tjOAcU . Am curious if anyone else has seen it?

    • With The Dark Tower (and as an avid fan) I think it’ll fall more into Western Drama Action Sci Fi, with elements of horror. Large description but they are genre crossing books. I’m not sure how strong they are going to hit on the horror side, it’s looking more action focused. Unless they show the gruesomeness of the lobstrosities and the possessed house, it doesn’t seem like movie one will have too many scares. There is much potential though, looking forward to how it comes together.

  28. Sadako vs. Kayako

    Let’s go back to the year 1998 and the release of “Ringu”, a movie that would revolutionize horror cinema and would bring a new aesthetic to American cinema for years to come. The movie, loosely based on a novel of the same name, tells the story of a cursed videotape containing the essence of an evil young woman named Sadako. On the tail end of Ringu comes another Japanese Horror film, Ju-On: The Grudge. This film tells the story of a vengeful ghost linked to a cursed home. Both films left an indelible mark on horror cinema so it really was only a matter of time until someone saw a cash grab in pitting the two monsters against one another. I guess you could say it was a “grudge” match in the “Ring”! HAHAHA!!!

    Shut up, that was funny.

    The curses for both characters are modified for this film, reducing the days for Sadako’s appearance to only two days and otherwiside diminishing both Kayako and her son, Toshio, to bit supporting parts as a pair of cursed girls try to pool their resources and force the two ghosts to do battle. The final hope is that the two spirits will destroy one another.

    Ultimately, the film doesn’t succeed nearly as much as the iconic images from the source materials. Sadako is somewhat reduced by showing a little too much and her spooking movements are somewhat overly exaggerated and look a little silly. Kayako is just as frightening as usual with her death croak, but the amount of cgi used to create her crawl felt a little overproduced. The movies lighting is a little dark at times, but this isn’t a surprise when you watch enough J-Horror.

    With that said, the film isn’t a total waste of time. It’s a fun popcorn b-picture with enough scary moments to keep the heart pumping. Some of the characters, like the casually dismissive psychi and his blind assistant, are amusing in a Japanese Anime-trope way.

    4.5 out of 10 and a very low priority rental.

  29. ****SPLIT SPOILERS****
    Just finished listening to your review of Split. It was an awesome movie but I was thoroughly confused by the last scene. I have seen Unbreakable but it has been years. I might have to go back and revisit that one.

    Also heard you talking about a movie “Crepitus”. Interesting to note that the word means “a grating sound that is made by bone against bone”…should make for an interesting watch. Loved this episode! Great job as usual.

    • That is an interesting to note about Crepitus. Thanks for sharing that, Brenda.

      Regarding your SPLIT spoilers …

      There is nothing much to the ending. Just that Split takes place in the same Universe as Unbreakable and so The Beast is a super-villain in the same sense that Mr. Glass was. We might seen Bruce Willis take him on next. ******

  30. Thanks for another great episode guys. You gave me a number of movies to look forward to this year and had me doubled over in laughter when you were trying to guess Josh’s picks. Even though I’m not too excited by The Bye Bye Man, I want to give it a shot because of the way it was discussed on this show. If I went on critical consensus for all my horror viewing, I wouldn’t have much to watch.

    I’ve also sought out a number of films that you guys have discussed on recent episodes. I saw Train to Busan, The Wailing, Under the Shadow, I Am Not a Serial Killer, just to mention a few. So often, I will see a new movie appear in the horror section of Netflix and not know whether or not it’s worth my time. Given that Netflix’s selection is highly hit or miss, I really appreciate hearing the input of the show’s hosts and greater community on new flicks to catch or avoid.

  31. I just finished the episode and am so happy that Josh loved Split! I don’t know why, but I’m always so excited when we have the same opinion on a movie and so disappointed when we don’t…i.e. The Neon Demon :(

    With that being said, I have to say that I’m so mad a Jay right now!! I LOVE him, but he makes me so mad sometimes!!! How can you give Split a 7.5 and take off points because it wasn’t full horror, but list No Escape as your #1 horror movie when it’s NOT a horror movie at all. It just doesn’t make sense to me. Plus, I’m just never going to forget that he rated “Would You Rather’ a 9…A 9!!!! And Split is a 7.5? Especially since M. Knight directed your favorite movie of all time…I think you would give him a bit more leeway.

    • Uh, oh. Jay’s in trouble. Glad I’m out of the dog house for being lukewarm on The Neon Demon. I wish I had seen this comment last night when we were recording. I could have held Jay’s feet to the flames for you.

      • Ghostbusters taught me that you’re not supposed to cross streams, but at least Jay rated Split higher than he did Gods of Egypt over at MPW. Honestly, we should all just be happy.

  32. So I saw Bye Bye Man and I don’t see all the hate for this movie! Will it be a classic? No… Is it fun? YES!

    I think this movie suffered from where the big budget money was spent. I think a lot of the 7.4 million dollars went into hirie some of the cast. Instead, the horror makeup and CGI should have been amped up.

    Sure there are some plot holes but all-in-all the movie was fun. I agree with Josh saying that it is a lot better than some of the older slasher films people hold so dear. Nostalgia sometimes leads us to be blind to the faults in those movies.


    • PV! Yes! I’m so glad you had fun with this film.

      Interesting insight about spending the money on casting. I’m sure you’re right. And I’m not sure Faye Dunaway or Carrie-Anne Moss really did much for the film. Moss more than Dunaway, but it could have been anyone in that role. I’d have preferred they spent that money on a better young cast (CakeWolf says that Ryan Gosling was originally attached???) or skipped the young kids and changed things up a bit with some slightly older actors. Based the story on the Leigh Whannell character with Jonathan Penner and Carrie-Anne Moss in the friend roles.

      I thought the key monster make-up was great. I just wanted WAY more screen time for Doug Jones and I’d have been happy to lose the beast or (as you said), put more money into it.

  33. I like to take notes and leave all my comments in one post.

    You guys should totally check out the new Archie series on Netflix. It’s pretty dark.

    The expolsive in the neck thing actually happened to a guy named Brian Douglas Wells who said he had been forced to rob a bank. It was determined that he had actually taken part in the planning but didn’t know that a real explosive device was going to be used. It was later made into a comedy starring Jesse Eisenberg, Danny McBride, Aziz Ansari and Nick Swardson.

    The main reason to see The Mummy is Sofia Boutella. I loved The Kingsmen and her look in Star Trek Beyond. Can you guys get Dr Shock to make that weird pronunciation of Tutankhamen?

    Shane Black should totally do a straight up sequel to The Nice Guys where they fight the Predator, but keep it a comedy.

    The only reason they make new Hellraiser movies is to keep ahold of the rights. I was really exited when Martyrs’ Pascal Laugier was supposed to make it but then he walked because the studio wanted him to make it pg 13. I guess they’ll continue to make garbage until they find their dream director again.

    The only way that Cage Dive movie works is if they don’t even get on the boat until 45 minutes in. And that would be really boring.

    There’s a new show coming out called Legion based on the marvel comics character David Haller. The premise is that he’s Professor X’s son and he has multiple personalities. Each personality has it’s own power. The original 3 personalities could use either telepathy, telekinesis, or pyrokinesis, but never more than one at a time. He’s since exhibited more.

    The movies I am personally looking forward to the most are:

    In a Valley of Violence
    The Void
    Master Cleanse
    The Lure
    Shrews Nest
    StakeLand 2
    We Go On
    We Are the Flesh

    • Putting all of these in one chunk is kind of a pain in the a to respond to, Joe. I like the notes idea, but could you maybe post the separate sections as replies to your initial comment to make it easier to reference?

      First, when you say to check out “the new Archie series on Netflix” are you referring to Riverdale on the CW – or something else? I checked out the first episode of Riverdale, but I’m up for any new Archie property, following Afterlife with Archie. I’ve recently been watching the animated series “Archie’s Weird Mysteries” with my kids, which is kind of trying to do a modern X-Files meet Scooby Doo, but falling a bit short. The vocal performances are BRUTAL. Still, it’s fun to mindlessly put a show featuring The Mummy or The Wolfman with my kids.

  34. Here’s my review for I WAS A TEENAGE WERESKUNK.

    Ordinary American teen, Curtis Albright, is unexpectedly sprayed by a strange skunk. Now, he’ll have to learn to control his hormones to avoid turning into a monster.

    I Was a Teenage Wereskunk is low budget comedy that satirizes teenage monster films of the 1950’s. This film has heart and there are some genuinely funny parts but much of the humor doesn’t work. Instead of a witty homage to the films it’s satirizing, Wereskunk often relies on cliches and modern jokes. Also, there could be more mystery and suspense in the story.

  35. Still working my way through the episode (that’s not a complaint. I have no problem listening to a 4.5-hour episode in bursts as my schedule permits).

    Wolfman, you say that innovative films spawn solid franchises (or words to that effect). As evidence for the opposition, I will say only two words: The Howling.

  36. Went to see Split and it seems like a pretty divisive movie. The couple sitting next to me and my friend hated it, but mostly because they thought the plot went on for too long and was overall a bit too weird for them. My friend also hated it, but for a very different reason. She was a vicitim of childhood sexual abuse and thought the whole concept of “your scars make you stronger” was outrageous. She pretty much hated the entire movie because she was pretty set that this was what M Night Shyamalan was trying to convey and he had no experience with it and pretended like he knew what would be going through the mind of someone like the main character. I on the other hand really enjoyed it, and thought Anya Taylor Joy’s performance rescued it because it was so believable and nuanced. I do agree with her that a couple of things were not so great, like the undeserved fate of the two other girls and the inclusion of the flashbacks. I think it could have been a lot more powerful if the past trauma had been left ambiguous and the ending wasn’t so “power to those who are broken” because that rhetoric just makes it seem like the movie is written by someone who has never experienced that kind of pain or doesn’t understand it.

    As for the bye-bye man, I’ve probably already said this but I agree with a lot of what you were saying Josh. It was an enjoyable concept, but the execution left a lot to be desired. Not sure if it is worth watching in theaters even though it was a cool idea.

    Looking forward to checking those new movies out when they get to theaters!

  37. Just got back from seeing Rings and found it to be more enjoyable than I had anticipated. When the trailers first released for this I was worried about the airplane sequence and the use of modern technology. A VHS tape is far more mysterious and frightening than a MOV file.
    Where Rings really succeeds is with its choice of sound track, pure suspense beats that added to the story. Modern technology was used to further the story not hinder it as I previously feared. The concept of “tails” and passing the video along reminded me of Final Destination, which I enjoyed. Some neat camera shots and use of the video in the background of scenes was a smart movie. As a sequel this film is string, despite some continuity issues, it is a solid chapter for The Ring series. Also featuring blind people in horror films is a trend that I hope continues, right now it’s working.
    Where Rings fails, the airplane scene was a little shaky, the movie would’ve been better without out it. Some cuts in the trailer I thought looked pretty neat weren’t in the movie (movies need to stop doing this with trailers).
    I’m sleep deprived while typing this review out so if nonsensical, I’ll write more tomorrow. At the end of the day, just go see Rings, it’s worth it!

    • I’m glad you had fun seeing Rings. Personally, it wasn’t my kind of movie and I left feeling as though I just saw the first cash grab in 2017’s horror lineup.

      Thinking back however, I’d have to agree with you on the soundtrack. That was pretty solid.

    • This is encouraging. The critics DOGGED this film, and I have always been a fan of the franchise, so I’m glad it wasn’t all bad!

      I feared for the film in regards to the MOV file as well. The original Ring succeeds because the tape is a cursed object, and even though the allegory of technology as a killer holds up in the now, the use of cursed items is the timeless ‘then’ which still inspires fear.

      I know the critics are usually unkind to the genre, so I am grateful for reviews like these that uplift the films we enjoy.

  38. I’ve not seen the Bye Bye Man and I didn’t have it on my radar until the podcast. Knowing that this is based on a real story actually makes me want to see it. I do think that fact gives it more leeway in that it doesn’t have to be over-the-top.
    Compared to movies such as The Conjuring 1 & 2 that are “loosely” based on “real” events I doubt this can compare, but a feeling of authenticity can go along way. Thanks for putting this on my radar Josh!

  39. Not sure if there is a thread discussing the killer bed movie you guys mentioned in 2017’s lineup…Have any of you ever watched the TV Show, Monsters? Running from late 80s to early 90s it’s a horror anthology show that I’ve always been fond of.

    There’s an episode about a killer bed in that show too. The episode is called, Pillow Talk. It’s one of the best episode on that show if you’re interested in checking it out.

    Not sure if there is a thread discussing the killer bed movie you guys mentioned in 2017’s lineup…Have any of you ever watched the TV Show, Monsters? Running from late 80s to early 90s it’s a horror anthology show that I’ve always been fond of.

    There’s an episode about a killer bed in that show too. The episode is called, Pillow Talk. It’s one of the best episode on that show if you’re interested in checking it out.


    I’d like to know if anyone has seen Death Bed: The Bed that Eats 1977? I’m curious about it but want to see if the community has thoughts on it first.


  40. Playing catch-up this week with some films on the Best of 2016 lists.

    (Disclaimer, these points may have been made in past episode threads; I am a new commentator, so bear with me!!)

    Don’t Breathe was an exceptional thriller, and I would love to nominate the Blind Man to the ranks of memorable horror villains. I suppose he needs a few more films under his belt to achieve Mike Myers/Freddy status, but I like where his head’s at: (read: twisted and murderous. The guy is on his way!)

    The Wailing really did a number on my mind. I wanted to thank the hosts for this recommendation, especially Josh’s high praise, for I may have otherwise missed it. I don’t want to go into spoilers on the comment boards for others who may have not seen it, but a spoiler-filled comment board is sort of what I’m seeking. I would love more resources or links to dig deeper into the South Korean lore, or the filmmaker himself so I can better understand the greater themes of this film.

    Any signposts towards which to point me, or useful discussion/reading would be much appreciated.

    Keep up the good work HMP, and I’ll keep playing catch-up!

  41. Just watched Rings yesterday and I was underwhelmed. I enjoyed the previews before the movie much more than the actual movie. I finally saw a preview for Get Out and is looks wonderful. You can feel the Insidious vibe in the preview. I also saw a preview for Life. Wow, can’t wait for that one, and not just because of Ryan Gossling and Jake Gyllenhaal (although, that’s nice too.) And finally, Ghost in the Shell. I was a huge horror and anime nerd in high school. Although it seems like this remake is far from mirroring the original it has a few new takes on the movie which I hope pan out. The budget for this movie must be through the roof judging from the preview. I have a feeling this movie is going to piss a lot of people off.

    And onto Rings…if this movie had been on it’s own not a third installment I bet it could have been much better. The Ring was a great movie for the time it was made. If I saw it now I don’t know how I would feel about it. In the age of the digital revolution I just don’t think this concept works anymore. It was certainly entertaining but there was not one point at which I felt scared, or even in suspense.

  42. I know it’s a little late, but got around to seeing Autopsy of Jane Doe, and I was really surprised on how good it was. It had a nice build up to the mystery that needed solved. It was pretty creepy in parts and staring at a naked corpse the whole time made me feel kinda dirty and uncomfortable. No way I could do Autopsy’s after seeing that. Recommend everyone check it out.
    I also saw Split a couple weeks back. I really liked this movie also. It wasn’t perfect, but overall, it was a great watch. One issue I had was with the Therapist. Not the acting, but her not able to see what was going on. I’ve spent time in a chair myself, and know if you see questionable behavior, you don’t wait to act on it. The other thing that bugged me a little bit was how he was able to live in the place he does without anyone knowing? People had to be keeping an eye on him with his disorder and everything. You just don’t monitor someone that has Split personalities? I mean come on, really? Besides though couple things, I really liked Split and it will most likely be on my Top 10.

    • I know you guys weren’t too big on it, but they canned the World War Z sequel too? I guess Paramount is done with the horror game?

    • From Yahoo Movies:

      “There was no specific reason given for why Friday the 13th was cancelled, although the article does mention that the poor performance of fellow horror movie Rings likely played a role in the decision.”

      Not sure whether I’m sad or relieved that the Friday the 13th reboot was cancelled, but either way, I think it sucks that it hinged on a stupid Ring movie.

  43. The gauntlet has been thrown down and Allyson with a “Y” is our current champion! Incredible. Allyson just CRUSHING Horror Movie Podcast’s Dead Serious Horror Challenge. CHECK! THIS! OUT!

    “Last month I had the perfect opportunity for the #deadserioushorror challenge.”

  44. Just got back from Split. I loved it. I watched it as Casey’s story, so it felt like a powerfully tense and tragic story with a great 70s horror feel to the tone and resolution of her journey. Her final scene was heartbreaking, and that’s what punctuated the film for me.

    The performances all around were incredible, and the road map was fun to try to predict, I had some things nailed and some not. In some ways, it reminded me of Silence of the Lambs in that so few movies even approach that hallowed ground in my book. This one approached for me. The distance is still undetermined at the moment.

    I can also see where people wouldn’t have that experience, especially if they watched it as Kevin’s movie, because the end scene’s become so much more significant that you’re experiencing a whole different thing. That super villain origin story angle, which is a different level of horrific or tragic or disturbing.

  45. Hello all! I am a long time fan of the show (pretty sure Wolfman Josh is my horror movie soulmate, our opinions are so in line). I have been shy about speaking up until now, cause, you know, social anxiety, but I just wanted say how much I enjoy both the content AND the boards of this podcast. Thanks everyone!

    • Thank you for facing your fears and commenting, Leslie! The numbers tell us we have a lot of listeners out there, but somehow it never seems real until we meet them, so it’s awesome to hear from you. My day is especially brightened to find a (horror) soulmate on Valentines Day. Haha. Welcome! It’s a great group here. Thanks for you support and for listening and we hope to hear from you again!

    • Glad you finally swung by, Leslie! Welcome… this is a safe place, so please don’t be shy about sharing your thoughts. The more perspectives we have in the discussion, the better.

  46. Should we be taking Split’s position on D.I.D. to be one of advocacy when the story took the main character into a more supernatural, superhuman realm? Is it sending the opposite message? Or is it just a weird flick with a questionable ending? Mixed feelings on this one.

    • It’s a great point, Hamanda Sandwich (and a great handle). I have mixed feelings about how we should be taking Split, as well. We’re going to discuss it again in an upcoming episode about disability in horror. Would love to hear your opinions on this. Thanks for listening and for commenting.

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